Difference between revisions of "Talk:Aramin"
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Er... information from the Anna Ivanovna fragment which now accompanies Igwolf's list would confirm this. How did I miss that text? I'm an idiot. | Er... information from the Anna Ivanovna fragment which now accompanies Igwolf's list would confirm this. How did I miss that text? I'm an idiot. | ||
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| + | ==A Timeline of Aramin's Life== | ||
| + | Noah: Ok. So this is as good a place as any to set up a bit of a timeline for Aramin. | ||
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| + | [[Ikulu's Correspondence to Philip, King of Macedon]] is, of course, addressed to Philip, 'King' of Macedon, so we can assume that it was written after he came to power, which would be in or around 359 BC. I presume that this fact can be said to be verified in game with the various libraries (and librarians) we have at our disposal, although I cannot say that I know of a contemporaneous source that gives the 359 BC date. | ||
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| + | According to the [[Conversation with Cain]], both Drelzne and Aramin accompanied Ikulu when she made her foray into [[Kebnekaise]]. So we can safely assume, I think, that as of 359 BC Aramin was alive. | ||
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| + | We have a year for both the birth and death of Aramin, which, if I recall, was located on her grave in Psoikanthe, those years being 370 - 389. But 370 - 389 'what', exactly? If we can determine at what time Psoikanthe was built, we will know what dating scheme Ikulu might have been using, but a likely guess would be the Roman ab urbe condita, (an example of which is contained in the [[Letter from Cn. Julius Agricola to his grandson, M. Claudius Cornelius Tacitus]]), yielding the years 383 BC to 364 BC. This could not be accurate, because it would mean Aramin died five years before Philip became king and Cain could not have thus seen her in the mountain. | ||
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| + | There is some debate, however, as to exactly when Rome was founded. Different classical historians give different times, and by using the dating system of one Velleius Paterculus (probably known to [[Nicephorous]] or [[Ezio]]), it puts the founding of Rome in 745 BC instead of 753 BC, bumping Aramin's dates up eight years to a much more reasonable 375 - 356 BC. This means Cain would have seen her when she was about 16 or 17, which makes sense. | ||
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| + | [[Ayesha]] mentioned that Aramin died in Illyria, and it so happens that Philip II campaigned there from around 359 BC to 356 BC. It seems quite likely that Aramin was killed during this time, possibly when Ikulu made her rendezvous with Philip after returning from Kebnekaise. | ||
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| + | Why else might this date be significant? Alexander was born to Olympias in 356. And I would wager he was born nine months, plus or minus, after Aramin died. | ||
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| + | Grief can make you do crazy things. | ||
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| + | One more thing: if Aramin lived 19 years, she survived a single Metonic cycle, one Enneadecaeteris. Significant? Maybe. | ||
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| + | Kerry: Doesn't the following quote strongly imply that [[Ikulu's Correspondence to Philip, King of Macedon]] was written after Igwilf went to the mountain with her daughters? | ||
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| + | * I've picked up a great deal about long-term preservation in these ruins, so I'm going to take the time to preserve Drylesna in Psoikanthe, in the heart of the mountain where she will be in a position to restart the human race should we fail. If only Aramin could have ... (lived?) | ||
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| + | Noah: Er... I'm not suggesting that it isn't. I presume Ikulu was in Kebnekaise and wrote the letter sometime between 359 (when Philip became king) and 356 (when I suppose Aramin died). I mean, she says in the letter she's staying with the Myconids. I guess I don't understand your question. | ||
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| + | Also, the last sentence you've quoted above is partially filled in by one of the [[Fragments in Cassandreia]]: | ||
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| + | If only Aramin could have been persuaded to take | ||
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| + | Also, we've never seen another reference to whoever that Uren is (or was). Cain didn't mention anything about anyone besides the daughters (although he got the impression she had other retainers). Oh well. Probably not important. | ||
Latest revision as of 15:37, 21 June 2007
tcm: wait, i thought Drelzne was in Psoikanthe?
Maggie sez: Uhm, maybe? N. has all my notes from that time - I gave him my notebook. N. - do you still have my stuff?
Noah: Yes, I've still got all your stuff. Most of it has been digitized, but the remainder will go to Dan just as soon as I can remember to give it to him.
To answer the question, though, Aramin was the daughter we reassembled in the Chamber of the Daughter. Drelzne may also be somewhere in Psoikanthe, either asleep or in stasis. I believe there is textual evidence to that effect spread over numerous fragments. The end of the shopping list reads "...before Drelzna...octopuses defeated." I've always taken that to mean "...before Drelzna awakes and octopuses defeated." That is, the shopping list contains the components required to revive Drelzne from her slumber.
Er... information from the Anna Ivanovna fragment which now accompanies Igwolf's list would confirm this. How did I miss that text? I'm an idiot.
A Timeline of Aramin's Life
Noah: Ok. So this is as good a place as any to set up a bit of a timeline for Aramin.
Ikulu's Correspondence to Philip, King of Macedon is, of course, addressed to Philip, 'King' of Macedon, so we can assume that it was written after he came to power, which would be in or around 359 BC. I presume that this fact can be said to be verified in game with the various libraries (and librarians) we have at our disposal, although I cannot say that I know of a contemporaneous source that gives the 359 BC date.
According to the Conversation with Cain, both Drelzne and Aramin accompanied Ikulu when she made her foray into Kebnekaise. So we can safely assume, I think, that as of 359 BC Aramin was alive.
We have a year for both the birth and death of Aramin, which, if I recall, was located on her grave in Psoikanthe, those years being 370 - 389. But 370 - 389 'what', exactly? If we can determine at what time Psoikanthe was built, we will know what dating scheme Ikulu might have been using, but a likely guess would be the Roman ab urbe condita, (an example of which is contained in the Letter from Cn. Julius Agricola to his grandson, M. Claudius Cornelius Tacitus), yielding the years 383 BC to 364 BC. This could not be accurate, because it would mean Aramin died five years before Philip became king and Cain could not have thus seen her in the mountain.
There is some debate, however, as to exactly when Rome was founded. Different classical historians give different times, and by using the dating system of one Velleius Paterculus (probably known to Nicephorous or Ezio), it puts the founding of Rome in 745 BC instead of 753 BC, bumping Aramin's dates up eight years to a much more reasonable 375 - 356 BC. This means Cain would have seen her when she was about 16 or 17, which makes sense.
Ayesha mentioned that Aramin died in Illyria, and it so happens that Philip II campaigned there from around 359 BC to 356 BC. It seems quite likely that Aramin was killed during this time, possibly when Ikulu made her rendezvous with Philip after returning from Kebnekaise.
Why else might this date be significant? Alexander was born to Olympias in 356. And I would wager he was born nine months, plus or minus, after Aramin died.
Grief can make you do crazy things.
One more thing: if Aramin lived 19 years, she survived a single Metonic cycle, one Enneadecaeteris. Significant? Maybe.
Kerry: Doesn't the following quote strongly imply that Ikulu's Correspondence to Philip, King of Macedon was written after Igwilf went to the mountain with her daughters?
- I've picked up a great deal about long-term preservation in these ruins, so I'm going to take the time to preserve Drylesna in Psoikanthe, in the heart of the mountain where she will be in a position to restart the human race should we fail. If only Aramin could have ... (lived?)
Noah: Er... I'm not suggesting that it isn't. I presume Ikulu was in Kebnekaise and wrote the letter sometime between 359 (when Philip became king) and 356 (when I suppose Aramin died). I mean, she says in the letter she's staying with the Myconids. I guess I don't understand your question.
Also, the last sentence you've quoted above is partially filled in by one of the Fragments in Cassandreia:
If only Aramin could have been persuaded to take
Also, we've never seen another reference to whoever that Uren is (or was). Cain didn't mention anything about anyone besides the daughters (although he got the impression she had other retainers). Oh well. Probably not important.
